I propose that political journalists who lecture on the pay & productivity 
of politicians should first have to disclose their own financial 
arrangements

-- 
FERGUS O'ROURKE
www.irish-lawyer.com
(Not just law stuff)

Scríobh "Fergus O'Rourke" :
>I propose that political journalists who lecture on the pay & productivity 
>of politicians should first have to disclose their own financial 
>arrangements

Why?

-- 
'Donegal:  Up Here It's Different'
© Féachadóir

"Féachadóir" <Féach@d.óir> wrote in message 
news:jmmvd4d807o073ng9mjskhpvac53sutbq9@4ax.com...
> Scríobh "Fergus O'Rourke" :
>>I propose that political journalists who lecture on the pay & productivity
>>of politicians should first have to disclose their own financial
>>arrangements
>
> Why?

So that the rest of us could assess the value of their opinions on 
"well-paid" "inadequate working hours" "minimal oversight" and "ridiculous 
expenses" .

More broadly, the media now have more power than politicians and we need to 
know where they, including thier influential commenators, are coming from in 
terms of their vested interests

On Sun, 28 Sep 2008 10:37:58 +0100, "Fergus O'Rourke"
 wrote:

>I propose that political journalists who lecture on the pay & productivity 
>of politicians should first have to disclose their own financial 
>arrangements

I actually think it is quite amusing when the Indo Journies.... quote
how they "like to holiday abroad 3 times a year like everyone else"
"hate the inconvience of two homes so far apart" and would really like
to get a little October long weekend break for under no more than 3 K
for the 2 adults and 2 kids.

Particularly amusing are the budget examples .....  

"Take an average couple Mary and Joe. Mary is in financial services
and earns 70K and Joe is in sales and earns 80K...  their tax
situation will be............"

"We had  decent lunch for a quite acceptable € 178.00 for 3 including
wine." !!!!!! 

I often wonder what planet they live on.........

Eddie    
"Going to church doesn't make you a Christian any 
 more than going to a garage makes you a mechanic."

On Wed, 01 Oct 2008 15:04:13 +0100, Eddie Wall  wrote:

>On Sun, 28 Sep 2008 10:37:58 +0100, "Fergus O'Rourke"
> wrote:
>
>>I propose that political journalists who lecture on the pay & productivity 
>>of politicians should first have to disclose their own financial 
>>arrangements
>
>I actually think it is quite amusing when the Indo Journies.... quote
>how they "like to holiday abroad 3 times a year like everyone else"
>"hate the inconvience of two homes so far apart" and would really like
>to get a little October long weekend break for under no more than 3 K
>for the 2 adults and 2 kids.
>
>Particularly amusing are the budget examples .....  
>
>"Take an average couple Mary and Joe. Mary is in financial services
>and earns 70K and Joe is in sales and earns 80K...  their tax
>situation will be............"
>
>"We had  decent lunch for a quite acceptable ¤ 178.00 for 3 including
>wine." !!!!!! 
>
>I often wonder what planet they live on.........
>
>Eddie    
>"Going to church doesn't make you a Christian any 
> more than going to a garage makes you a mechanic."


I've just had an argument at work when I suggested anyone on 30000 a
year was rich. 

The subject of minimum wage and these greedy twats had come up
http://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/3717522.Police__having_to_take_second_jobs_/

Alang wrote:
> On Wed, 01 Oct 2008 15:04:13 +0100, Eddie Wall  wrote:
>
>> On Sun, 28 Sep 2008 10:37:58 +0100, "Fergus O'Rourke"
>>  wrote:
>>
>>> I propose that political journalists who lecture on the pay &
>>> productivity of politicians should first have to disclose their own
>>> financial arrangements
>>
>> I actually think it is quite amusing when the Indo Journies.... quote
>> how they "like to holiday abroad 3 times a year like everyone else"
>> "hate the inconvience of two homes so far apart" and would really
>> like to get a little October long weekend break for under no more
>> than 3 K for the 2 adults and 2 kids.
>>
>> Particularly amusing are the budget examples .....
>>
>> "Take an average couple Mary and Joe. Mary is in financial services
>> and earns 70K and Joe is in sales and earns 80K...  their tax
>> situation will be............"
>>
>> "We had  decent lunch for a quite acceptable ¤ 178.00 for 3 including
>> wine." !!!!!!
>>
>> I often wonder what planet they live on.........
>>
>> Eddie
>> "Going to church doesn't make you a Christian any
>> more than going to a garage makes you a mechanic."
>
>
> I've just had an argument at work when I suggested anyone on 30000 a
> year was rich.
>
> The subject of minimum wage and these greedy twats had come up
> http://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/3717522.Police__having_to_take_second_jobs_/

£30,000 p/a does NOT make anyone rich! After taxes and other deductions 
there is not a lot left. What Planet are you on?

-- 
Hal Ó Mearadhaigh.

(Glac bóg an saol agus glacfaidh an saol bóg thú).

On Thu, 2 Oct 2008 09:26:16 +0100, "Hal Ó Mearadhaigh."
 wrote:

>> I've just had an argument at work when I suggested anyone on 30000 a
>> year was rich.

>> The subject of minimum wage and these greedy twats had come up
>> http://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/3717522.Police__having_to_take_second_jobs_/

>£30,000 p/a does NOT make anyone rich! After taxes and other deductions 
>there is not a lot left. What Planet are you on?

Quite.  Simply do the sums.  After deducting the government's (huge)
cut (about £8500), rent or mortgage repayments, utility bills, council
tax, food and other necessary living expenses such as the cost of
commuting to work, running a car etc, you will find that there is not
a heck of a lot of disposable income left over.  It is an income that
will allow a person to live modestly without hardship, but is far from
being an income that will make you rich.

A back-of-the-envelope calculation shows that a person living in very
modest accomodation (1 bed flat) in an area such as Southampton would
have about £5000 left over per annum after ordinary living expenses.
Deduct £1000 from that for occasional necessary purchases during an
average year (furniture, white goods, repairs, medical), and you are
left with under £80 per week to blow.  £80 a week will hardly allow
you to live the life of a high-roller.  Maybe a drink or two of an
evening, a subscription TV service and an occasional trip to the pub
or cinema - not even enough for a decent annual holiday.  It is hardly
a rich man's lifestyle.

-- 
Cynic

On Thu, 2 Oct 2008 09:26:16 +0100, "Hal Ó Mearadhaigh."
 wrote:

>Alang wrote:
>> On Wed, 01 Oct 2008 15:04:13 +0100, Eddie Wall  wrote:
>>
>>> On Sun, 28 Sep 2008 10:37:58 +0100, "Fergus O'Rourke"
>>>  wrote:
>>>
>>>> I propose that political journalists who lecture on the pay &
>>>> productivity of politicians should first have to disclose their own
>>>> financial arrangements
>>>
>>> I actually think it is quite amusing when the Indo Journies.... quote
>>> how they "like to holiday abroad 3 times a year like everyone else"
>>> "hate the inconvience of two homes so far apart" and would really
>>> like to get a little October long weekend break for under no more
>>> than 3 K for the 2 adults and 2 kids.
>>>
>>> Particularly amusing are the budget examples .....
>>>
>>> "Take an average couple Mary and Joe. Mary is in financial services
>>> and earns 70K and Joe is in sales and earns 80K...  their tax
>>> situation will be............"
>>>
>>> "We had  decent lunch for a quite acceptable ¤ 178.00 for 3 including
>>> wine." !!!!!!
>>>
>>> I often wonder what planet they live on.........
>>>
>>> Eddie
>>> "Going to church doesn't make you a Christian any
>>> more than going to a garage makes you a mechanic."
>>
>>
>> I've just had an argument at work when I suggested anyone on 30000 a
>> year was rich.
>>
>> The subject of minimum wage and these greedy twats had come up
>> http://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/3717522.Police__having_to_take_second_jobs_/
>
>£30,000 p/a does NOT make anyone rich! After taxes and other deductions 
>there is not a lot left.

There is a lot more over than for someone on minimum wage or ona
pension 

> What Planet are you on?

A shitty one

On Thu, 02 Oct 2008 12:38:33 +0100, Cynic 
wrote:

>On Thu, 2 Oct 2008 09:26:16 +0100, "Hal Ó Mearadhaigh."
> wrote:
>
>>> I've just had an argument at work when I suggested anyone on 30000 a
>>> year was rich.
>
>>> The subject of minimum wage and these greedy twats had come up
>>> http://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/3717522.Police__having_to_take_second_jobs_/
>
>>£30,000 p/a does NOT make anyone rich! After taxes and other deductions 
>>there is not a lot left. What Planet are you on?
>
>Quite.  Simply do the sums.  After deducting the government's (huge)
>cut (about £8500), rent or mortgage repayments, utility bills, council
>tax, food and other necessary living expenses such as the cost of
>commuting to work, running a car etc, you will find that there is not
>a heck of a lot of disposable income left over.  It is an income that
>will allow a person to live modestly without hardship, but is far from
>being an income that will make you rich.
>
>A back-of-the-envelope calculation shows that a person living in very
>modest accomodation (1 bed flat) in an area such as Southampton would
>have about £5000 left over per annum after ordinary living expenses.
>Deduct £1000 from that for occasional necessary purchases during an
>average year (furniture, white goods, repairs, medical), and you are
>left with under £80 per week to blow.  £80 a week will hardly allow
>you to live the life of a high-roller.  Maybe a drink or two of an
>evening, a subscription TV service and an occasional trip to the pub
>or cinema - not even enough for a decent annual holiday.  It is hardly
>a rich man's lifestyle.


So tell me how wealthy someone on 10000  a year manages.

Alang  gurgled happily, sounding much like they
were saying:

>>A back-of-the-envelope calculation shows that a person living in very
>>modest accomodation (1 bed flat) in an area such as Southampton would
>>have about £5000 left over per annum after ordinary living expenses.
>>Deduct £1000 from that for occasional necessary purchases during an
>>average year (furniture, white goods, repairs, medical), and you are
>>left with under £80 per week to blow.  £80 a week will hardly allow you
>>to live the life of a high-roller.  Maybe a drink or two of an evening,
>>a subscription TV service and an occasional trip to the pub or cinema -
>>not even enough for a decent annual holiday.  It is hardly a rich man's
>>lifestyle.

> So tell me how wealthy someone on 10000  a year manages.

The person on £30k will have a lot more outgoings than the person on £10k 
- income tax & NI, council tax. They won't have assistance towards their 
rent, prescriptions or many other expenses.

Sure, they won't be in such dire poverty as the person on £10k, but 
that's a LONG way from meaning they're "rich". £30k isn't much above the 
average weekly full-time pay.

On 2008-10-02 15:38:27 +0100, Alang  said:

> On Thu, 02 Oct 2008 12:38:33 +0100, Cynic 
> wrote:
> 
>> On Thu, 2 Oct 2008 09:26:16 +0100, "Hal Ó Mearadhaigh."
>>  wrote:
>> 
>>>> I've just had an argument at work when I suggested anyone on 30000 a
>>>> year was rich.
>> 
>>>> The subject of minimum wage and these greedy twats had come up
>>>> http://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/3717522.Police__having_to_take_second_jobs_/

£30,000 
>>>> 
>>> p/a does NOT make anyone rich! After taxes and other deductions
>>> there is not a lot left. What Planet are you on?
>> 
>> Quite.  Simply do the sums.  After deducting the government's (huge)
>> cut (about £8500), rent or mortgage repayments, utility bills, council
>> tax, food and other necessary living expenses such as the cost of
>> commuting to work, running a car etc, you will find that there is not
>> a heck of a lot of disposable income left over.  It is an income that
>> will allow a person to live modestly without hardship, but is far from
>> being an income that will make you rich.
>> 
>> A back-of-the-envelope calculation shows that a person living in very
>> modest accomodation (1 bed flat) in an area such as Southampton would
>> have about £5000 left over per annum after ordinary living expenses.
>> Deduct £1000 from that for occasional necessary purchases during an
>> average year (furniture, white goods, repairs, medical), and you are
>> left with under £80 per week to blow.  £80 a week will hardly allow
>> you to live the life of a high-roller.  Maybe a drink or two of an
>> evening, a subscription TV service and an occasional trip to the pub
>> or cinema - not even enough for a decent annual holiday.  It is hardly
>> a rich man's lifestyle.
> 
> 
> So tell me how wealthy someone on 10000  a year manages.

Quite a lot of them manage to spend long hours at my local Ladbrokes shop.

Stan

On 2 Oct 2008 14:48:19 GMT, Adrian  wrote:

>Alang  gurgled happily, sounding much like they
>were saying:
>
>>>A back-of-the-envelope calculation shows that a person living in very
>>>modest accomodation (1 bed flat) in an area such as Southampton would
>>>have about £5000 left over per annum after ordinary living expenses.
>>>Deduct £1000 from that for occasional necessary purchases during an
>>>average year (furniture, white goods, repairs, medical), and you are
>>>left with under £80 per week to blow.  £80 a week will hardly allow you
>>>to live the life of a high-roller.  Maybe a drink or two of an evening,
>>>a subscription TV service and an occasional trip to the pub or cinema -
>>>not even enough for a decent annual holiday.  It is hardly a rich man's
>>>lifestyle.
>
>> So tell me how wealthy someone on 10000  a year manages.
>
>The person on £30k will have a lot more outgoings than the person on £10k 
>- income tax & NI, council tax. They won't have assistance towards their 
>rent, prescriptions or many other expenses.

Someone on 10000 a year will pay income tax and NI and council tax.
Unless they are married with children they will not get any assistance
with rent , prescriptions or anything else. For a married couple with
no children the cut off point for *any* benefits was up until april
this year under 190 per week. It may have gone up since then but not
by much.
>
>Sure, they won't be in such dire poverty as the person on £10k, but 
>that's a LONG way from meaning they're "rich". £30k isn't much above the 
>average weekly full-time pay.

Lots of rich people in this country then.

On Thu, 2 Oct 2008 17:35:47 +0100, Stan The Man  wrote:

>On 2008-10-02 15:38:27 +0100, Alang  said:
>
>> On Thu, 02 Oct 2008 12:38:33 +0100, Cynic 
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> On Thu, 2 Oct 2008 09:26:16 +0100, "Hal Ó Mearadhaigh."
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>>>> I've just had an argument at work when I suggested anyone on 30000 a
>>>>> year was rich.
>>> 
>>>>> The subject of minimum wage and these greedy twats had come up
>>>>> http://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/3717522.Police__having_to_take_second_jobs_/
>
>£30,000 
>>>>> 
>>>> p/a does NOT make anyone rich! After taxes and other deductions
>>>> there is not a lot left. What Planet are you on?
>>> 
>>> Quite.  Simply do the sums.  After deducting the government's (huge)
>>> cut (about £8500), rent or mortgage repayments, utility bills, council
>>> tax, food and other necessary living expenses such as the cost of
>>> commuting to work, running a car etc, you will find that there is not
>>> a heck of a lot of disposable income left over.  It is an income that
>>> will allow a person to live modestly without hardship, but is far from
>>> being an income that will make you rich.
>>> 
>>> A back-of-the-envelope calculation shows that a person living in very
>>> modest accomodation (1 bed flat) in an area such as Southampton would
>>> have about £5000 left over per annum after ordinary living expenses.
>>> Deduct £1000 from that for occasional necessary purchases during an
>>> average year (furniture, white goods, repairs, medical), and you are
>>> left with under £80 per week to blow.  £80 a week will hardly allow
>>> you to live the life of a high-roller.  Maybe a drink or two of an
>>> evening, a subscription TV service and an occasional trip to the pub
>>> or cinema - not even enough for a decent annual holiday.  It is hardly
>>> a rich man's lifestyle.
>> 
>> 
>> So tell me how wealthy someone on 10000  a year manages.
>
>Quite a lot of them manage to spend long hours at my local Ladbrokes shop.
>
How do you know what they earn and what they have left as disposable
income?

On Thu, 02 Oct 2008 15:38:27 +0100, Alang 
wrote:

>>>£30,000 p/a does NOT make anyone rich! After taxes and other deductions 
>>>there is not a lot left. What Planet are you on?

>>Quite.  Simply do the sums.  After deducting the government's (huge)
>>cut (about £8500), rent or mortgage repayments, utility bills, council
>>tax, food and other necessary living expenses such as the cost of
>>commuting to work, running a car etc, you will find that there is not
>>a heck of a lot of disposable income left over.  It is an income that
>>will allow a person to live modestly without hardship, but is far from
>>being an income that will make you rich.

>>A back-of-the-envelope calculation shows that a person living in very
>>modest accomodation (1 bed flat) in an area such as Southampton would
>>have about £5000 left over per annum after ordinary living expenses.
>>Deduct £1000 from that for occasional necessary purchases during an
>>average year (furniture, white goods, repairs, medical), and you are
>>left with under £80 per week to blow.  £80 a week will hardly allow
>>you to live the life of a high-roller.  Maybe a drink or two of an
>>evening, a subscription TV service and an occasional trip to the pub
>>or cinema - not even enough for a decent annual holiday.  It is hardly
>>a rich man's lifestyle.

>So tell me how wealthy someone on 10000  a year manages. 

Is that net or gross income?

By having an extremely substandard lifestyle.  Probably also having
government handouts or concessions and/or not needing to pay rent or
mortgage.  Youngsters can often manage by clubbing together, living in
a communal residence and sharing the costs of rent, utilities etc.,
but they have the expectation that things will get a lot better as
their income increases in the years ahead, and young people are far
more ameniable to such a lifestyle than older people.

-- 
Cynic

On Thu, 2 Oct 2008 17:35:47 +0100, Stan The Man  wrote:

>> So tell me how wealthy someone on 10000  a year manages.
>
>Quite a lot of them manage to spend long hours at my local Ladbrokes shop.

Perhaps because they are homeless.

-- 
Cynic

On Thu, 02 Oct 2008 15:35:44 +0100, Alang 
wrote:

>>£30,000 p/a does NOT make anyone rich! After taxes and other deductions 
>>there is not a lot left.
>
>There is a lot more over than for someone on minimum wage or ona
>pension 

Yes.  A person on minimum wage cannot survive without assistance
unless they are working extremely long hours.  Pernsioners can survive
at an extremely low standard of living because they have many
concessions & handouts, and have typically built up assets such as a
home, funiture and other goods that reduce their outgoings.

-- 
Cynic

On 2008-10-02 19:16:22 +0100, Alang  said:

> On Thu, 2 Oct 2008 17:35:47 +0100, Stan The Man  wrote:
> 
>> On 2008-10-02 15:38:27 +0100, Alang  said:
>> 
>>> On Thu, 02 Oct 2008 12:38:33 +0100, Cynic 
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> On Thu, 2 Oct 2008 09:26:16 +0100, "Hal Ó Mearadhaigh."
>>>>  wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>>> I've just had an argument at work when I suggested anyone on 30000 a
>>>>>> year was rich.
>>>> 
>>>>>> The subject of minimum wage and these greedy twats had come up
>>>>>> http://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/3717522.Police__having_to_take_second_jobs_/

£30,000

p/a 
>>>>>> 
>>>>> does NOT make anyone rich! After taxes and other deductions
>>>>> there is not a lot left. What Planet are you on?
>>>> 
>>>> Quite.  Simply do the sums.  After deducting the government's (huge)
>>>> cut (about £8500), rent or mortgage repayments, utility bills, council
>>>> tax, food and other necessary living expenses such as the cost of
>>>> commuting to work, running a car etc, you will find that there is not
>>>> a heck of a lot of disposable income left over.  It is an income that
>>>> will allow a person to live modestly without hardship, but is far from
>>>> being an income that will make you rich.
>>>> 
>>>> A back-of-the-envelope calculation shows that a person living in very
>>>> modest accomodation (1 bed flat) in an area such as Southampton would
>>>> have about £5000 left over per annum after ordinary living expenses.
>>>> Deduct £1000 from that for occasional necessary purchases during an
>>>> average year (furniture, white goods, repairs, medical), and you are
>>>> left with under £80 per week to blow.  £80 a week will hardly allow
>>>> you to live the life of a high-roller.  Maybe a drink or two of an
>>>> evening, a subscription TV service and an occasional trip to the pub
>>>> or cinema - not even enough for a decent annual holiday.  It is hardly
>>>> a rich man's lifestyle.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> So tell me how wealthy someone on 10000  a year manages.
>> 
>> Quite a lot of them manage to spend long hours at my local Ladbrokes shop.
>> 
> How do you know what they earn and what they have left as disposable
> income?

I was making a general point: that no matter how near the breadline 
people are, those who like to fritter money away in betting shops 
somehow find money to fritter.

Stan

greymaus wrote:
> On 2008-10-03, Cynic  wrote:
>> On Thu, 2 Oct 2008 17:35:47 +0100, Stan The Man  wrote:
>>
>>>> So tell me how wealthy someone on 10000  a year manages.
>>>
>>> Quite a lot of them manage to spend long hours at my local
>>> Ladbrokes shop.
>>
>> Perhaps because they are homeless.
>>
>
> There was a man I knew years ago, long term unemployed, some children,
> went to pub every day where he usually got some work, would share in
> getting turf, great lifestyle. He won Lotto. Now he is just another
> miserable git.

Because you removed (or your software did) the other ngs (now restored), the 
English people who were the only ones continuing the discussion will in all 
probability only see it now.

-- 
FERGUS O'ROURKE
www.irish-lawyer.com
(Not just law stuff)

On Fri, 3 Oct 2008 13:08:37 +0100, Stan The Man  wrote:

>On 2008-10-02 19:16:22 +0100, Alang  said:
>
>> On Thu, 2 Oct 2008 17:35:47 +0100, Stan The Man  wrote:
>> 
>>> On 2008-10-02 15:38:27 +0100, Alang  said:
>>> 
>>>> On Thu, 02 Oct 2008 12:38:33 +0100, Cynic 
>>>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> On Thu, 2 Oct 2008 09:26:16 +0100, "Hal Ó Mearadhaigh."
>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>>> I've just had an argument at work when I suggested anyone on 30000 a
>>>>>>> year was rich.
>>>>> 
>>>>>>> The subject of minimum wage and these greedy twats had come up
>>>>>>> http://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/3717522.Police__having_to_take_second_jobs_/
>
>£30,000
>
>p/a 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>> does NOT make anyone rich! After taxes and other deductions
>>>>>> there is not a lot left. What Planet are you on?
>>>>> 
>>>>> Quite.  Simply do the sums.  After deducting the government's (huge)
>>>>> cut (about £8500), rent or mortgage repayments, utility bills, council
>>>>> tax, food and other necessary living expenses such as the cost of
>>>>> commuting to work, running a car etc, you will find that there is not
>>>>> a heck of a lot of disposable income left over.  It is an income that
>>>>> will allow a person to live modestly without hardship, but is far from
>>>>> being an income that will make you rich.
>>>>> 
>>>>> A back-of-the-envelope calculation shows that a person living in very
>>>>> modest accomodation (1 bed flat) in an area such as Southampton would
>>>>> have about £5000 left over per annum after ordinary living expenses.
>>>>> Deduct £1000 from that for occasional necessary purchases during an
>>>>> average year (furniture, white goods, repairs, medical), and you are
>>>>> left with under £80 per week to blow.  £80 a week will hardly allow
>>>>> you to live the life of a high-roller.  Maybe a drink or two of an
>>>>> evening, a subscription TV service and an occasional trip to the pub
>>>>> or cinema - not even enough for a decent annual holiday.  It is hardly
>>>>> a rich man's lifestyle.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> So tell me how wealthy someone on 10000  a year manages.
>>> 
>>> Quite a lot of them manage to spend long hours at my local Ladbrokes shop.
>>> 
>> How do you know what they earn and what they have left as disposable
>> income?
>
>I was making a general point: that no matter how near the breadline 
>people are, those who like to fritter money away in betting shops 
>somehow find money to fritter.
>
But those people might be on 30000 a year or more for all you know

On Fri, 03 Oct 2008 10:00:47 +0100, Cynic 
wrote:

>On Thu, 02 Oct 2008 15:38:27 +0100, Alang 
>wrote:
>
>>>>£30,000 p/a does NOT make anyone rich! After taxes and other deductions 
>>>>there is not a lot left. What Planet are you on?
>
>>>Quite.  Simply do the sums.  After deducting the government's (huge)
>>>cut (about £8500), rent or mortgage repayments, utility bills, council
>>>tax, food and other necessary living expenses such as the cost of
>>>commuting to work, running a car etc, you will find that there is not
>>>a heck of a lot of disposable income left over.  It is an income that
>>>will allow a person to live modestly without hardship, but is far from
>>>being an income that will make you rich.
>
>>>A back-of-the-envelope calculation shows that a person living in very
>>>modest accomodation (1 bed flat) in an area such as Southampton would
>>>have about £5000 left over per annum after ordinary living expenses.
>>>Deduct £1000 from that for occasional necessary purchases during an
>>>average year (furniture, white goods, repairs, medical), and you are
>>>left with under £80 per week to blow.  £80 a week will hardly allow
>>>you to live the life of a high-roller.  Maybe a drink or two of an
>>>evening, a subscription TV service and an occasional trip to the pub
>>>or cinema - not even enough for a decent annual holiday.  It is hardly
>>>a rich man's lifestyle.
>
>>So tell me how wealthy someone on 10000  a year manages. 
>
>Is that net or gross income?
>
>By having an extremely substandard lifestyle. 

Depends on what you call a substandard lifestyle.
The 30000 a year person can have exactly the same outgoings as the
10000 a year person but with more than double the income left after
government pocket dipping. 

> Probably also having
>government handouts or concessions and/or not needing to pay rent or
>mortgage. 

A single person on that income will get no assistance from the state.
In fact I'm fairly sure a married couple would get nothing either.

> Youngsters can often manage by clubbing together, living in
>a communal residence and sharing the costs of rent, utilities etc.,
>but they have the expectation that things will get a lot better as
>their income increases in the years ahead, and young people are far
>more ameniable to such a lifestyle than older people.

Yes. We used to live in one room with a hole in the yard and a tap
shared between 4 families. But that was about 40 yrs ago and I don't
think the governemnt will let people live like that. They much prefer
to see them homeless than living in sub standard accomodation.

On Fri, 03 Oct 2008 10:09:57 +0100, Cynic 
wrote:

>On Thu, 02 Oct 2008 15:35:44 +0100, Alang 
>wrote:
>
>>>£30,000 p/a does NOT make anyone rich! After taxes and other deductions 
>>>there is not a lot left.
>>
>>There is a lot more over than for someone on minimum wage or ona
>>pension 
>
>Yes.  A person on minimum wage cannot survive without assistance
>unless they are working extremely long hours. 

They most certainly can. It isn't fun but it can be done. Millions do
it every week

> Pernsioners can survive
>at an extremely low standard of living because they have many
>concessions & handouts, and have typically built up assets such as a
>home, funiture and other goods that reduce their outgoings.

True to some extent. But many get nothing and are stuck when their
assets need replacing or repair.