Trying to get my head around everything before I complain.

Today was the first payday since the new owners took over the business.

Last month my tax code was 543L.  This month it is 603L.

For some reason my basic pay has been cut by 25% and overtime has not 
been included.

NI has gone down by 40%

Tax has gone UP by 15%

I thought that the idea of changing the code was that we got £60 back - 
or am I missing something?

PS I am paying basic rate only.

Rob. wrote:
> Trying to get my head around everything before I complain.
> 
> Today was the first payday since the new owners took over the business.
> 
> Last month my tax code was 543L.  This month it is 603L.
> 
> For some reason my basic pay has been cut by 25% and overtime has not 
> been included.
> 
> NI has gone down by 40%
> 
> Tax has gone UP by 15%
> 
> I thought that the idea of changing the code was that we got £60 back - 
> or am I missing something?
> 
> PS I am paying basic rate only.
On the face of it that does not make sense.

Suggest you ask your employer to check the tax deduction.

Rob. wrote:
> Trying to get my head around everything before I complain.
> 
> Today was the first payday since the new owners took over the business.
> 
> Last month my tax code was 543L.  This month it is 603L.
> 
> For some reason my basic pay has been cut by 25% and overtime has not 
> been included.
> 
> NI has gone down by 40%
> 
> Tax has gone UP by 15%
> 
> I thought that the idea of changing the code was that we got £60 back - 
> or am I missing something?
> 
> PS I am paying basic rate only.

I'm £60 lower this month with nothing on my payslip about a £60 rebate :(

"Rob."  wrote in message
news:48dd2068$1_2@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com...
> Trying to get my head around everything before I complain.
>
> Today was the first payday since the new owners took over the business.
>
> Last month my tax code was 543L.  This month it is 603L.
>
> For some reason my basic pay has been cut by 25% and overtime has not
> been included.
>
> NI has gone down by 40%
>
> Tax has gone UP by 15%
>
> I thought that the idea of changing the code was that we got £60 back -

For most people...

> or am I missing something?

PAYE tax works on a year to date basis. Have you not been working for the full
tax year (ie since April), or does your pay fluctuate a lot?

--
Andy

Rob. wrote:
> Trying to get my head around everything before I complain.
>
> Today was the first payday since the new owners took over the
> business.

This may be relevant. If they are continuing with the same trade then 
they ought to be operating the same PAYE scheme.  But even some payroll 
operators get that wrong.  To check this:

a.    did you get a P45?
b.    does your latest payslip show pay and tax to date?


> Last month my tax code was 543L.  This month it is 603L.
>
> For some reason my basic pay has been cut by 25% and overtime has not
> been included.

Have the new owners changed the pay period?

> NI has gone down by 40%
>
> Tax has gone UP by 15%

That does indeed seem odd but it'd help if you felt able to share actual 
figures from your payslip for pay and tax, and for total  and pay and 
tax to date.

-- 
Robin

"Rob."  wrote in message 
news:48dd2068$1_2@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com...
> Trying to get my head around everything before I complain.
>
> Today was the first payday since the new owners took over the business.
>
> Last month my tax code was 543L.  This month it is 603L.
>
> For some reason my basic pay has been cut by 25% and overtime has not been 
> included.
>
> NI has gone down by 40%
>
> Tax has gone UP by 15%
>
> I thought that the idea of changing the code was that we got £60 back - or 
> am I missing something?
>
> PS I am paying basic rate only.

Post the Gross Pay, Tax and NIC here and I am sure that many would have a 
look for you. The payslip should show the Gross Pay to date and tax to date 
figures and you will need to post them too.

Rob. wrote:
> 
> Last month my tax code was 543L.  This month it is 603L.
> 
> I thought that the idea of changing the code was that we got £60 back - 
> or am I missing something?

Over the whole year, you will get back your marginal tax rate times £600.

I can't remember if the basic rate is still 22%, but assuming it is, and it is your highest rate both before and after the change, you will get 
back £132 over the year.

This month you will only get back the proportion for the year so far, 
which, I think, is something between about 44 and 55 pounds.

However, if you have had major tax position changes recently, and 
possibly if paying this much excess in one go would cause hardship to 
the employer, you might be on a month one tax basis, in which case you 
should only get back £11 each month, with the underpayment being 
corrected by next year's tax code.

You will only get exactly £60 back over the year if your marginal rate, 
both before and after, is 10%.  However, wasn't the whole point that 
there was no longer a 10% band.

I wonder if you are being paid on a different day.  If you are being 
paid earlier, that might well explain the anomalies in the figures.  I'm not 100% sure how monthly cumulative basis is calculated, but if the 
allowance is only stepped each month, you might have been in the same 
month, and therefore not had any allowance.  If that's the case, one can make an estimate of your salary!

neverwas wrote:
> Rob. wrote:
>> Trying to get my head around everything before I complain.
>>
>> Today was the first payday since the new owners took over the
>> business.
> 
> This may be relevant. If they are continuing with the same trade then 
> they ought to be operating the same PAYE scheme.  But even some payroll 
> operators get that wrong.  To check this:
> 
> a.    did you get a P45?
> b.    does your latest payslip show pay and tax to date?
> 
> 
>> Last month my tax code was 543L.  This month it is 603L.
>>
>> For some reason my basic pay has been cut by 25% and overtime has not
>> been included.
> 
> Have the new owners changed the pay period?
> 
>> NI has gone down by 40%
>>
>> Tax has gone UP by 15%
> 
> That does indeed seem odd but it'd help if you felt able to share actual 
> figures from your payslip for pay and tax, and for total  and pay and 
> tax to date.
> 


August 15

Total Payments 1195.25

IT 15540
NI 85.39

TGP 6031.38
IT   787.80

not got slip to hand for 30 august (change over ) but P45 gives

Total Pay 6586.48
IT         759.60

Sep 20 (pay period seems to have changed)

Total Payments 892.50

IT 178.60
NI 52.08

TGP 7478.98
IT 938.20

There seems to have been a tax refund of about £28 on 30 August ( 
Ithought it was due after 7/9?) but the IT seems to have leaped up this 
month.

Rob. wrote:
> neverwas wrote:
>> Rob. wrote:
>>> Trying to get my head around everything before I complain.
>>>
>>> Today was the first payday since the new owners took over the
>>> business.
>>
>> This may be relevant. If they are continuing with the same trade then 
>> they ought to be operating the same PAYE scheme.  But even some 
>> payroll operators get that wrong.  To check this:
>>
>> a.    did you get a P45?
>> b.    does your latest payslip show pay and tax to date?
>>
>>
>>> Last month my tax code was 543L.  This month it is 603L.
>>>
>>> For some reason my basic pay has been cut by 25% and overtime has not
>>> been included.
>>
>> Have the new owners changed the pay period?
>>
>>> NI has gone down by 40%
>>>
>>> Tax has gone UP by 15%
>>
>> That does indeed seem odd but it'd help if you felt able to share 
>> actual figures from your payslip for pay and tax, and for total  and 
>> pay and tax to date.
>>
> 
> 
> August 15
> 
> Total Payments 1195.25
> 
> IT 15540
> NI 85.39
> 
> TGP 6031.38
> IT   787.80
> 
> not got slip to hand for 30 august (change over ) but P45 gives
> 
> Total Pay 6586.48
> IT         759.60
> 
> Sep 20 
> 
> Total Payments 892.50
> 
> IT 178.60
> NI 52.08
> 
> TGP 7478.98
> IT 938.20
> 
> There seems to have been a tax refund of about £28 on 30 August ( 
> Ithought it was due after 7/9?) but the IT seems to have leaped up this 
> month.

I have just tried the HMRC PAYE calculator on the August and September 
figures and it gives the answer as above - but I don't understand why. 
Does the fact that it is only for 3 weeks make a difference?

"Rob."  wrote in message
news:48ddc8eb$1_4@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com...
> >> Trying to get my head around everything before I complain.
> >>
> >> Today was the first payday since the new owners took over the
> >> business.
> >
> > This may be relevant. If they are continuing with the same trade then
> > they ought to be operating the same PAYE scheme.  But even some payroll
> > operators get that wrong.  To check this:
> >
> > a.    did you get a P45?
> > b.    does your latest payslip show pay and tax to date?
> >
> >
> >> Last month my tax code was 543L.  This month it is 603L.
> >>
> >> For some reason my basic pay has been cut by 25% and overtime has not
> >> been included.
> >
> > Have the new owners changed the pay period?
> >
> >> NI has gone down by 40%
> >>
> >> Tax has gone UP by 15%
> >
> > That does indeed seem odd but it'd help if you felt able to share actual
> > figures from your payslip for pay and tax, and for total  and pay and
> > tax to date.
> >
>
>
> August 15
>
> Total Payments 1195.25
>
> IT 15540
> NI 85.39
>
> TGP 6031.38
> IT   787.80

Right, so you must have been paid 4-weekly, not monthly. You get paid 13 times a
year, not 12.

Total IT = INT (TGP - 5439*(5/13) ) * 0.2

> not got slip to hand for 30 august (change over ) but P45 gives
>
> Total Pay 6586.48
> IT         759.60

Don't understand that... what's the final tax code on the P45?

If it's 603L it almost makes sense if they paid it in advance as the 6th (of 13)
pay periods.

> Sep 20 (pay period seems to have changed)
>
> Total Payments 892.50
>
> IT 178.60
> NI 52.08
>
> TGP 7478.98
> IT 938.20

Looks right.

Total IT = INT (TGP - 6039*(6/13) ) * 0.2

> There seems to have been a tax refund of about £28 on 30 August (
> Ithought it was due after 7/9?) but the IT seems to have leaped up this
> month.

It looks like as far as tax goes, your 30 Aug and 20 Sept pay were both in the
same 4-week period. That's why you paid so much this month. It'll be less next
month.

--
Andy

> I have just tried the HMRC PAYE calculator on the August and September
> figures and it gives the answer as above - but I don't understand why. 
> Does the fact that it is only for 3 weeks make a difference?

I think you have had a reduction in your tax - but in the last payment from 
your old employer.

I think what happended was this:

you were paid *in September* for the period up until the end of August 
*using the new tax code 603*.  From what you say I think this was:

pay    £555.1
tax     -£28.20

You got this refund because, in effect:

a.    the whole of your personal allowance for September was set given 
against that small amount of pay.  So you got back some of the tax already 
paid for April-August; and
b.    you got the benefit of the increased code - so you got back even more 
of the tax already paid for April-August

Then you were paid on 20 Sep.  This was your *second* payment in that pay 
period.  (The figures suggest to me you are paid every 4 weeks.) So when 
your new employer worked out the tax to be deducted you had in effect 
already had the benefit of your persoanl allowaance for September.  So all 
the pay fell into the basic rate band: £178.60 is 20% of 892.50 (within the 
roundings).

Another way is to look at the total of your final pay from the old employer 
and first from your new:

pay    £1,447.60    tax    £150.40

But I am an out-of-date old f**t and could well be wrong.  If so I am sure a 
thrusting young blood will be along shortly to correct me.

Oh and the NI works differently.  I sued to understand it once upon a time 
but I value my sanity too much to go there again;)
-- 
R

neverwas wrote:
>> I have just tried the HMRC PAYE calculator on the August and September
>> figures and it gives the answer as above - but I don't understand why. 
>> Does the fact that it is only for 3 weeks make a difference?
> 
> I think you have had a reduction in your tax - but in the last payment from 
> your old employer.
> 
> I think what happended was this:
> 
> you were paid *in September* for the period up until the end of August 
> *using the new tax code 603*.  From what you say I think this was:
> 
> pay    £555.1
> tax     -£28.20
> 
> You got this refund because, in effect:
> 
> a.    the whole of your personal allowance for September was set given 
> against that small amount of pay.  So you got back some of the tax already 
> paid for April-August; and
> b.    you got the benefit of the increased code - so you got back even more 
> of the tax already paid for April-August
> 
> Then you were paid on 20 Sep.  This was your *second* payment in that pay 
> period.  (The figures suggest to me you are paid every 4 weeks.) So when 
> your new employer worked out the tax to be deducted you had in effect 
> already had the benefit of your persoanl allowaance for September.  So all 
> the pay fell into the basic rate band: £178.60 is 20% of 892.50 (within the 
> roundings).
> 
> Another way is to look at the total of your final pay from the old employer 
> and first from your new:
> 
> pay    £1,447.60    tax    £150.40
> 
> But I am an out-of-date old f**t and could well be wrong.  If so I am sure a 
> thrusting young blood will be along shortly to correct me.
> 
> Oh and the NI works differently.  I sued to understand it once upon a time 
> but I value my sanity too much to go there again;)

I think that makes sense. However if they had paid the whole 4 weeks up 
to 27th September the HMRC PAYE calculator says that the IT would have 
been £145.  I'm sure it wil all work out in the Tax Return.