It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in 
Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK 
to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding 
housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course, 
fully entitled to.

Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody 
seems to have noticed...

-- 
William Black

"Any number under six"

The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of 
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat 
single handed with a quarterstaff.

On Nov 3, 12:35 pm, William Black  wrote:
> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in
> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK
> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding
> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course,
> fully entitled to.
>
> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody
> seems to have noticed...

Ah! Yes! I mean to say! Err!

These are indigenous people well steeped in and appreciative of
British Culture. Direct descendants of Alfred the Great no doubt.

"William Black"  wrote in message 
news:hcp81v$c7r$1@news.eternal-september.org...
> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in 
> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK to 
> throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding housing, 
> hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course, fully entitled 
> to.
>
> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody 
> seems to have noticed...
>
> -- 
> William Black
>

White, english born and bred and paid taxes for most of their working life. 
No problem..

Black, coloured, Brown, muslim, haven't paid money into the system, 
demanding housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are of course 
not entitled to.  Big Problem.

Mel Rowing wrote:
> On Nov 3, 12:35 pm, William Black  wrote:
>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in
>> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK
>> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding
>> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course,
>> fully entitled to.
>>
>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody
>> seems to have noticed...
> 
> Ah! Yes! I mean to say! Err!
> 
> These are indigenous people well steeped in and appreciative of
> British Culture. Direct descendants of Alfred the Great no doubt.

So, you expect to see them in their posses hanging round the shops wit 
der homies dealing drugs and mugging the OAPs? Or am I thinking of some 
other "immigrants"?

-- 
Dirk

http://www.transcendence.me.uk/ - Transcendence UK
http://www.theconsensus.org/ - A UK political party
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/onetribe - Occult Talk Show

On Nov 3, 1:05 pm, "Mick"  wrote:
> "William Black"  wrote in message
>
> news:hcp81v$c7r$1@news.eternal-september.org...
>
> > It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in
> > Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK to
> > throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding housing> > hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course, fully entitled
> > to.
>
> > Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody
> > seems to have noticed...
>
> > --
> > William Black
>
> White, english born and bred and paid taxes for most of their working life.
> No problem..

Certainly not for the past 20 years and in living abroad they have
exported the income generated within their  pension schemes.

> Black, coloured, Brown, muslim, haven't paid money into the system,
> demanding housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are of course
> not entitled to.  Big Problem.

Predominantly young and as liable to tax as anyone else which they
will continue to pay for many years no doubt subsidising some of the
above.

On Nov 3, 1:07 pm, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax 
wrote:
> Mel Rowing wrote:
> > On Nov 3, 12:35 pm, William Black  wrote:
> >> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in
> >> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK
> >> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding
> >> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course,
> >> fully entitled to.
>
> >> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody
> >> seems to have noticed...
>
> > Ah! Yes! I mean to say! Err!
>
> > These are indigenous people well steeped in and appreciative of
> > British Culture. Direct descendants of Alfred the Great no doubt.
>
> So, you expect to see them in their posses hanging round the shops wit
> der homies dealing drugs and mugging the OAPs? Or am I thinking of some
> other "immigrants"?

Where that happens I think you'll find that one or two of our
"indigenous" population have become involved also. Roguery is roguery
and no society is free of it.

William Black wrote:
> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in 
> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK 
> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding 
> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course, 
> fully entitled to.
> 
> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody 
> seems to have noticed...
> 

  There could be terrorists amongst them to, or terrorist sympathisers?
You know what these lapsed Cof E people can be like.

Dirk Bruere at NeoPax wrote:

> Mel Rowing wrote:

>> These are indigenous people well steeped in and appreciative of
>> British Culture. Direct descendants of Alfred the Great no doubt.

> So, you expect to see them in their posses hanging round the shops wit 
> der homies dealing drugs and mugging the OAPs? Or am I thinking of some 
> other "immigrants"?

We should indeed expect that.  We're all equal after all.  The crime 
statistics are obviously institutionally racist for reporting that 
Negroes commit 45% of all crimes in London and 79% of all violent 
crimes.  There is clear cultural bias at play and I applaud the BBC for 
doing their best to redress this shocking imbalance by withholding 
information relating to the ethnicity of black criminals and only 
broadcasting the ethnic background of white criminals.  That's what I 
call equality.

Mel Rowing wrote:

>> So, you expect to see them in their posses hanging round the shops wit
>> der homies dealing drugs and mugging the OAPs? Or am I thinking of some
>> other "immigrants"?

> Where that happens I think you'll find that one or two of our
> "indigenous" population have become involved also.

Well, there's no doubt that Negro culture has had a detrimental effect 
on the white lower classes.

Mick wrote:
> "William Black"  wrote in message 
> news:hcp81v$c7r$1@news.eternal-september.org...
>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in 
>> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK to 
>> throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding housing, 
>> hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course, fully entitled 
>> to.
>>
>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody 
>> seems to have noticed...
>>
>> -- 
>> William Black
>>
> 
> White, english born and bred and paid taxes for most of their working life. 
> No problem..

They've spent twenty years sucking money out of the UK and contributed 
not one penny.

-- 
William Black

"Any number under six"

The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of 
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat 
single handed with a quarterstaff.

Dirk Bruere at NeoPax wrote:
> Mel Rowing wrote:
>> On Nov 3, 12:35 pm, William Black  wrote:
>>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in
>>> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK
>>> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding
>>> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course,
>>> fully entitled to.
>>>
>>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody
>>> seems to have noticed...
>>
>> Ah! Yes! I mean to say! Err!
>>
>> These are indigenous people well steeped in and appreciative of
>> British Culture. Direct descendants of Alfred the Great no doubt.
> 
> So, you expect to see them in their posses hanging round the shops wit 
> der homies dealing drugs and mugging the OAPs? Or am I thinking of some 
> other "immigrants"?
> 

I think you'll find that the vast majority are a bit long in the tooth 
for that.

Although I imagine a fair proportion from the 'Costa del Crime' will get 
back to their old tricks pretty quickly...


-- 
William Black

"Any number under six"

The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of 
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat 
single handed with a quarterstaff.

White Spirit wrote:
> Dirk Bruere at NeoPax wrote:
> 
>> Mel Rowing wrote:
> 
>>> These are indigenous people well steeped in and appreciative of
>>> British Culture. Direct descendants of Alfred the Great no doubt.
> 
>> So, you expect to see them in their posses hanging round the shops wit 
>> der homies dealing drugs and mugging the OAPs? Or am I thinking of 
>> some other "immigrants"?
> 
> We should indeed expect that.  We're all equal after all.  The crime 
> statistics are obviously institutionally racist for reporting that 
> Negroes commit 45% of all crimes in London and 79% of all violent 
> crimes.  There is clear cultural bias at play and I applaud the BBC for 
> doing their best to redress this shocking imbalance by withholding 
> information relating to the ethnicity of black criminals and only 
> broadcasting the ethnic background of white criminals.  That's what I 
> call equality.
> 

I imagine the old lags coming back from the 'Costa del Crime' will 
integrate pretty quickly.

-- 
William Black

"Any number under six"

The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of 
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat 
single handed with a quarterstaff.

On Nov 3, 1:23 pm, White Spirit  wrote:
> Dirk Bruere at NeoPax wrote:
>
> > Mel Rowing wrote:
> >> These are indigenous people well steeped in and appreciative of
> >> British Culture. Direct descendants of Alfred the Great no doubt.
> > So, you expect to see them in their posses hanging round the shops wit
> > der homies dealing drugs and mugging the OAPs? Or am I thinking of some
> > other "immigrants"?
>
> We should indeed expect that.  We're all equal after all.  The crime
> statistics are obviously institutionally racist for reporting that
> Negroes commit 45% of all crimes in London and 79% of all violent
> crimes.  There is clear cultural bias at play and I applaud the BBC for
> doing their best to redress this shocking imbalance by withholding
> information relating to the ethnicity of black criminals and only
> broadcasting the ethnic background of white criminals.  That's what I
> call equality.

You are of course about to tell us the source of these statistics?

White Spirit wrote:
> Mel Rowing wrote:
> 
>>> So, you expect to see them in their posses hanging round the shops wit
>>> der homies dealing drugs and mugging the OAPs? Or am I thinking of some
>>> other "immigrants"?
> 
>> Where that happens I think you'll find that one or two of our
>> "indigenous" population have become involved also.
> 
> Well, there's no doubt that Negro culture has had a detrimental effect 
> on the white lower classes.
> 

I blame Elvis...

-- 
William Black

"Any number under six"

The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of 
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat 
single handed with a quarterstaff.

Mel Rowing wrote:

> On Nov 3, 1:23 pm, White Spirit  wrote:

>> We should indeed expect that.  We're all equal after all.  The crime
>> statistics are obviously institutionally racist for reporting that
>> Negroes commit 45% of all crimes in London and 79% of all violent
>> crimes.  There is clear cultural bias at play and I applaud the BBC for
>> doing their best to redress this shocking imbalance by withholding
>> information relating to the ethnicity of black criminals and only
>> broadcasting the ethnic background of white criminals.  That's what I
>> call equality.

> You are of course about to tell us the source of these statistics?

The institutionally racist Metropolitan Police ;)

On Nov 3, 1:23 pm, White Spirit  wrote:
> Dirk Bruere at NeoPax wrote:
>
> > Mel Rowing wrote:
> >> These are indigenous people well steeped in and appreciative of
> >> British Culture. Direct descendants of Alfred the Great no doubt.
> > So, you expect to see them in their posses hanging round the shops wit
> > der homies dealing drugs and mugging the OAPs? Or am I thinking of some
> > other "immigrants"?
>
> We should indeed expect that.  We're all equal after all.  The crime
> statistics are obviously institutionally racist for reporting that
> Negroes commit 45% of all crimes in London and 79% of all violent
> crimes.  There is clear cultural bias at play and I applaud the BBC for
> doing their best to redress this shocking imbalance by withholding
> information relating to the ethnicity of black criminals and only
> broadcasting the ethnic background of white criminals.  That's what I
> call equality.

You are of course going to let us have the benefit of knowing the
source of these "statistics" ?

On Tue, 3 Nov 2009 06:09:13 -0800 (PST), Mel Rowing
 wrote:

>On Nov 3, 1:23 pm, White Spirit  wrote:
>> Dirk Bruere at NeoPax wrote:
>>
>> > Mel Rowing wrote:
>> >> These are indigenous people well steeped in and appreciative of
>> >> British Culture. Direct descendants of Alfred the Great no doubt.
>> > So, you expect to see them in their posses hanging round the shops wit
>> > der homies dealing drugs and mugging the OAPs? Or am I thinking of some
>> > other "immigrants"?
>>
>> We should indeed expect that.  We're all equal after all.  The crime
>> statistics are obviously institutionally racist for reporting that
>> Negroes commit 45% of all crimes in London and 79% of all violent
>> crimes.  There is clear cultural bias at play and I applaud the BBC for
>> doing their best to redress this shocking imbalance by withholding
>> information relating to the ethnicity of black criminals and only
>> broadcasting the ethnic background of white criminals.  That's what I
>> call equality.
>
>You are of course about to tell us the source of these statistics?

Only the insane can't see it for themselves. But some like, Row,Black
et al have someone to wipe their ars** for them - *provided* of course
some survey has been done first and a report given to them that they
have shi* themsleves.

William Black wrote:
> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in 
> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK 
> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding 
> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course, 
> fully entitled to.
> 
> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody 
> seems to have noticed...
> 

What does that matter? Do you think that British citizens should have 
the natural right of abode here or not? If not, where else, or nowhere 
at all?

Maria wrote:

> William Black wrote:

>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in 
>> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK 
>> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding 
>> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course, 
>> fully entitled to.

>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody 
>> seems to have noticed...

> What does that matter? Do you think that British citizens should have 
> the natural right of abode here or not? If not, where else, or nowhere 
> at all?

I think he prefers the idea that foreign migrants have British 
citizenship while the indigenous British (or white British if you 
prefer, since he denies the existence of the indigenous British) move 
out to look for work.  Quite how we're supposed to find said work abroad 
or even in our own country I'm not sure, since we're all so lazy and yet 
have the audacity to demand higher wages and more benefits than a Polish 
or Indian worker.

On Nov 3, 4:04 pm, Maria  wrote:
> William Black wrote:
> > It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in
> > Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK
> > to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding
> > housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course,
> > fully entitled to.
>
> > Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody
> > seems to have noticed...
>
> What does that matter? Do you think that British citizens should have
> the natural right of abode here or not? If not, where else, or nowhere
> at all?

There is not even a question of a British citizen having right of
abode in the UK. It's simply a matter of law.

However, it should never be forgotten that one man's rights or
entitlements are another's liabilities.

Maria wrote:
> William Black wrote:
>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in 
>> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK 
>> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding 
>> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course, 
>> fully entitled to.
>>
>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody 
>> seems to have noticed...
>>
> 
> What does that matter? Do you think that British citizens should have 
> the natural right of abode here or not? If not, where else, or nowhere 
> at all?

Of course they have the right to live here.

But why should they have the right to medical treatment,  free housing 
and an index linked pension?


-- 
William Black

"Any number under six"

The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of 
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat 
single handed with a quarterstaff.

White Spirit wrote:
> Maria wrote:
> 
>> William Black wrote:
> 
>>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices 
>>> in Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to 
>>> the UK to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  
>>> demanding housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of 
>>> course, fully entitled to.
> 
>>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody 
>>> seems to have noticed...
> 
>> What does that matter? Do you think that British citizens should have 
>> the natural right of abode here or not? If not, where else, or nowhere 
>> at all?
> 
> I think he prefers the idea that foreign migrants have British 
> citizenship while the indigenous British (or white British if you 
> prefer, since he denies the existence of the indigenous British) move 
> out to look for work.  Quite how we're supposed to find said work abroad 
> or even in our own country I'm not sure, since we're all so lazy and yet 
> have the audacity to demand higher wages and more benefits than a Polish 
> or Indian worker.

I have no objection to them living here.

I object to them collecting benefits and receiving medical treatment and 
getting free housing without paying any taxes.



-- 
William Black

"Any number under six"

The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of 
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat 
single handed with a quarterstaff.

Mel Rowing wrote:
> On Nov 3, 4:04 pm, Maria  wrote:
>> William Black wrote:
>>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in
>>> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK
>>> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding
>>> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course,
>>> fully entitled to.
>>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody
>>> seems to have noticed...
>> What does that matter? Do you think that British citizens should have
>> the natural right of abode here or not? If not, where else, or nowhere
>> at all?
> 
> There is not even a question of a British citizen having right of
> abode in the UK. It's simply a matter of law.

And morally?

> 
> However, it should never be forgotten that one man's rights or
> entitlements are another's liabilities.
> 

Sorry?

On Nov 3, 12:35 pm, William Black  wrote:
> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in
> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK
> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding
> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course,
> fully entitled to.
>
> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody
> seems to have noticed...
>
> --
> William Black
>
> "Any number under six"
>
> The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of
> Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat
> single handed with a quarterstaff.

What has that got to do with it?

It’s their homeland.

I thought you were all for freedom of choice?

William Black wrote:
> Maria wrote:
>> William Black wrote:
>>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices 
>>> in Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to 
>>> the UK to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  
>>> demanding housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of 
>>> course, fully entitled to.
>>>
>>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody 
>>> seems to have noticed...
>>>
>>
>> What does that matter? Do you think that British citizens should have 
>> the natural right of abode here or not? If not, where else, or nowhere 
>> at all?
> 
> Of course they have the right to live here.
> 
> But why should they have the right to medical treatment,  free housing 

As long as everyone else does, then why not? It's called Rule of Law.
NB what makes you think that they would automatically get housed? And 
it's not 'free' by the way - they would have little savings and to 
either sign on or be pensioners or incapacitated to get any benefit, 
just like anyone else.

> and an index linked pension?

Who has an index-linked pension?

On Nov 3, 12:58 pm, Mel Rowing  wrote:
> On Nov 3, 12:35 pm, William Black  wrote:
>
> > It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in
> > Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK
> > to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding
> > housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course,
> > fully entitled to.
>
> > Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody
> > seems to have noticed...
>
> Ah! Yes! I mean to say! Err!
>
> These are indigenous people well steeped in and appreciative of
> British Culture. Direct descendants of Alfred the Great no doubt.

Yes, you would rather have thousands of useless third world savages
adding their own brand of 'culture'!

Maria wrote:
> William Black wrote:
>> Maria wrote:
>>> William Black wrote:
>>>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices 
>>>> in Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to 
>>>> the UK to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  
>>>> demanding housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  
>>>> of course, fully entitled to.
>>>>
>>>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but 
>>>> nobody seems to have noticed...
>>>>
>>>
>>> What does that matter? Do you think that British citizens should have 
>>> the natural right of abode here or not? If not, where else, or 
>>> nowhere at all?
>>
>> Of course they have the right to live here.
>>
>> But why should they have the right to medical treatment,  free housing 
> 
> As long as everyone else does, then why not? It's called Rule of Law.

But many immigrants who pay taxes are not allowed access to public 
housing and several other benefits...

> NB what makes you think that they would automatically get housed? And 
> it's not 'free' by the way - they would have little savings and to 
> either sign on or be pensioners or incapacitated to get any benefit, 
> just like anyone else.
> 
>> and an index linked pension?
> 
> Who has an index-linked pension?

Everyone.

That's the point about all this.

People who collect a UK Old Age Pension overseas soon discover it 
doesn't go up every year...


-- 
William Black

"Any number under six"

The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of 
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat 
single handed with a quarterstaff.

Sam wrote:
> On Nov 3, 12:35 pm, William Black  wrote:
>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in
>> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK
>> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding
>> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course,
>> fully entitled to.
>>
>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody
>> seems to have noticed...
>>
>> --
>> William Black
>>
>> "Any number under six"
>>
>> The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of
>> Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat
>> single handed with a quarterstaff.
> 
> What has that got to do with it?
> 
> It’s their homeland.
> 
> I thought you were all for freedom of choice?

I am.

I'm also for people collecting from our benefits system only if they've 
paid into it.


-- 
William Black

"Any number under six"

The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of 
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat 
single handed with a quarterstaff.

Maria wrote:
> Mel Rowing wrote:
>> On Nov 3, 4:04 pm, Maria  wrote:
>>> William Black wrote:
>>>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in
>>>> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK
>>>> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding
>>>> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course,
>>>> fully entitled to.
>>>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody
>>>> seems to have noticed...
>>> What does that matter? Do you think that British citizens should have
>>> the natural right of abode here or not? If not, where else, or nowhere
>>> at all?
>>
>> There is not even a question of a British citizen having right of
>> abode in the UK. It's simply a matter of law.
> 
> And morally?
> 
>>
>> However, it should never be forgotten that one man's rights or
>> entitlements are another's liabilities.
>>
> 
> Sorry?

He means 'Why should they be allowed free access to our benefits system 
and social services and health system as they haven't paid a penny into 
it and have been sucking at the teat of the pension system to pay for 
their lavish lifestyle overseas for years?'

They're not coming back because they want to,  they're coming back 
because they're broke.


-- 
William Black

"Any number under six"

The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of 
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat 
single handed with a quarterstaff.

William Black wrote:
> Maria wrote:
>> William Black wrote:
>>> Maria wrote:
>>>> William Black wrote:
>>>>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices 
>>>>> in Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to 
>>>>> the UK to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  
>>>>> demanding housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  
>>>>> of course, fully entitled to.
>>>>>
>>>>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but 
>>>>> nobody seems to have noticed...
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> What does that matter? Do you think that British citizens should 
>>>> have the natural right of abode here or not? If not, where else, or 
>>>> nowhere at all?
>>>
>>> Of course they have the right to live here.
>>>
>>> But why should they have the right to medical treatment,  free housing 
>>
>> As long as everyone else does, then why not? It's called Rule of Law.
> 
> But many immigrants who pay taxes are not allowed access to public 
> housing and several other benefits...

For one year. They are presumed to be able to pay for their own, just 
like anyone else in work, unless they have special needs. Some of
tThose migrant workers with dependent children seem to have been housed.

>> NB what makes you think that they would automatically get housed? And 
>> it's not 'free' by the way - they would have little savings and to 
>> either sign on or be pensioners or incapacitated to get any benefit, 
>> just like anyone else.
>>
>>> and an index linked pension?
>>
>> Who has an index-linked pension?
> 
> Everyone.
> 
> That's the point about all this.
> 
> People who collect a UK Old Age Pension overseas soon discover it 
> doesn't go up every year...
> 
> 

I thought the pension was not linked to the RPI?

William Black wrote:
> Maria wrote:
>> Mel Rowing wrote:
>>> On Nov 3, 4:04 pm, Maria  wrote:
>>>> William Black wrote:
>>>>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in
>>>>> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK
>>>>> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding
>>>>> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course,
>>>>> fully entitled to.
>>>>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody
>>>>> seems to have noticed...
>>>> What does that matter? Do you think that British citizens should have
>>>> the natural right of abode here or not? If not, where else, or nowhere
>>>> at all?
>>>
>>> There is not even a question of a British citizen having right of
>>> abode in the UK. It's simply a matter of law.
>>
>> And morally?
>>
>>>
>>> However, it should never be forgotten that one man's rights or
>>> entitlements are another's liabilities.
>>>
>>
>> Sorry?
> 
> He means 'Why should they be allowed free access to our benefits system 
> and social services and health system 

Because everyone else who is a British citizen is entitled to do so. ?

>as they haven't paid a penny into 
> it and have been sucking at the teat of the pension system to pay for 
> their lavish lifestyle overseas for years?'

How are they entitled to a pension if they didn't pay in? How is 
claiming one's pension 'sucking at the teat'?
Mel is very keen on the notion of entitlement, especially wrt pensions.

> 
> They're not coming back because they want to,  they're coming back 
> because they're broke.

So what? Nobody claims because they 'want to' (apart from scroungers who 
have no intention of working) - people claim because they 'need' to.
Perhaps since Britain pays £20 million to support the absent children of 
Polish workers, it's time to introduce an EU-wide benefits system, 
especially since it looks like full integration is on the cards.

Maria wrote:
> William Black wrote:
>> Maria wrote:
>>> Mel Rowing wrote:
>>>> On Nov 3, 4:04 pm, Maria  wrote:
>>>>> William Black wrote:
>>>>>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property 
>>>>>> prices in
>>>>>> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to 
>>>>>> the UK
>>>>>> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding
>>>>>> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course,
>>>>>> fully entitled to.
>>>>>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody
>>>>>> seems to have noticed...
>>>>> What does that matter? Do you think that British citizens should have
>>>>> the natural right of abode here or not? If not, where else, or nowhere
>>>>> at all?
>>>>
>>>> There is not even a question of a British citizen having right of
>>>> abode in the UK. It's simply a matter of law.
>>>
>>> And morally?
>>>
>>>>
>>>> However, it should never be forgotten that one man's rights or
>>>> entitlements are another's liabilities.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Sorry?
>>
>> He means 'Why should they be allowed free access to our benefits 
>> system and social services and health system 
> 
> Because everyone else who is a British citizen is entitled to do so. ?
>

Perhaps you think they should be stripped of British citizenship after a 
while? Of course that would be difficult under the EU Freedom of 
Movement principle...

William Black wrote:
> Sam wrote:
>> On Nov 3, 12:35 pm, William Black  wrote:
>>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in
>>> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK
>>> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding
>>> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course,
>>> fully entitled to.
>>>
>>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody
>>> seems to have noticed...
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> William Black
>>>
>>> "Any number under six"
>>>
>>> The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of
>>> Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat
>>> single handed with a quarterstaff.
>>
>> What has that got to do with it?
>>
>> It’s their homeland.
>>
>> I thought you were all for freedom of choice?
> 
> I am.
> 
> I'm also for people collecting from our benefits system only if they've 
> paid into it.
> 
> 

So all those British people who have never paid in or not paid in very 
much will not be entitled to anything at all - they'll have to beg, 
steal or starve and live in a bush?

Mel Rowing wrote:
> On Nov 3, 1:05 pm, "Mick"  wrote:
>> "William Black"  wrote in message
>>
>> news:hcp81v$c7r$1@news.eternal-september.org...
>>
>>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in
>>> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK to
>>> throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding housing,
>>> hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course, fully entitled
>>> to.
>>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody
>>> seems to have noticed...
>>> --
>>> William Black
>> White, english born and bred and paid taxes for most of their working life.
>> No problem..
> 
> Certainly not for the past 20+ years and in living abroad they have
> exported the income generated within their  pension schemes.

So Poles should not be allowed any entitlements at all if they are 
sending all their wages back to Poland, ditto Pakistanis, Filipinos etc etc.

On Nov 3, 4:46 pm, William Black  wrote:
> Sam wrote:
> > On Nov 3, 12:35 pm, William Black  wrote:
> >> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in
> >> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK
> >> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding
> >> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course,
> >> fully entitled to.
>
> >> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody
> >> seems to have noticed...
>
> >> --
> >> William Black
>
> >> "Any number under six"
>
> >> The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of
> >> Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat
> >> single handed with a quarterstaff.
>
> > What has that got to do with it?
>
> > It’s their homeland.
>
> > I thought you were all for freedom of choice?
>
> I am.
>
> I'm also for people collecting from our benefits system only if they've
> paid into it.
>
> --
> William Black
>
> "Any number under six"
>
> The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of
> Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat
> single handed with a quarterstaff.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

So, based on that statement i would think that you are against said
immigrants who have never paid into the system?

Well, my father lives in Spain.  He also comes back to England on
business, where he still maintains a residence.  Seeing as he has paid
into the system all his life, and seeing as he 'chose' to leave this
country; it would be his right, as a British citizen, to return to his
homeland and claim what he was entitled to.  But seeing as he isn't
coming back, or in need of financial aid from the government, I would
assume that those who are coming back have also paid into the system,
thus, they are more than entitled to government help.  Or do you think
we should refuse them entry, and instead, take in a few more thousand
useless carcasses who don’t speak the lingo, and are unemployable?

William Black wrote:
> Mick wrote:
>> "William Black"  wrote in message 
>> news:hcp81v$c7r$1@news.eternal-september.org...
>>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices 
>>> in Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to 
>>> the UK to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  
>>> demanding housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of 
>>> course, fully entitled to.
>>>
>>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody 
>>> seems to have noticed...
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> William Black
>>>
>>
>> White, english born and bred and paid taxes for most of their working 
>> life. No problem..
> 
> They've spent twenty years sucking money out of the UK and contributed 
> not one penny.
> 

So have thousands of people chucked out of work during the Thatcher era. 
What do you want to do with them?

On Tue, 03 Nov 2009 04:58:35 -0800, Mel Rowing wrote:

> On Nov 3, 12:35 pm, William Black  wrote:
>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in
>> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK
>> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding
>> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course,
>> fully entitled to.
>>
>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody
>> seems to have noticed...
> 
> Ah! Yes! I mean to say! Err!
> 
> These are indigenous people well steeped in and appreciative of British
> Culture. Direct descendants of Alfred the Great no doubt.

as opposed to yourself, direct descendant of king david or something is 
it? or some 2-bit gropecunt lane whore?

On Tue, 03 Nov 2009 12:35:08 +0000, William Black wrote:

> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in
> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK
> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding
> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course,
> fully entitled to.
> 
> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody
> seems to have noticed...

hundreds of thousands?

lived there 20 years or so?

your source?

FrereTuck wrote:
> On Tue, 03 Nov 2009 12:35:08 +0000, William Black wrote:
> 
>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in
>> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK
>> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding
>> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course,
>> fully entitled to.
>>
>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody
>> seems to have noticed...
> 
> hundreds of thousands?
> 
> lived there 20 years or so?
> 
> your source?

Looks like a wind-up to me anyway - there is nothing in the news about 
it, and the expected flood that was reported at the beginning of the 
credit crunch does not seem to have materialised.
He also hasn't said that they ought not to be entitled to vote, since 
they have no interest in how Britain is run.

On Tue, 03 Nov 2009 17:45:34 +0000, Maria wrote:

> FrereTuck wrote:
>> On Tue, 03 Nov 2009 12:35:08 +0000, William Black wrote:
>> 
>>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in
>>> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK
>>> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding
>>> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course,
>>> fully entitled to.
>>>
>>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody
>>> seems to have noticed...
>> 
>> hundreds of thousands?
>> 
>> lived there 20 years or so?
>> 
>> your source?
> 
> Looks like a wind-up to me anyway - there is nothing in the news about
> it, and the expected flood that was reported at the beginning of the
> credit crunch does not seem to have materialised. He also hasn't said
> that they ought not to be entitled to vote, since they have no interest
> in how Britain is run.

ex-pats don't lose their vote. and shouldn't lose their vote.

Of course they have an interest in how Britain is run, they may have 
moved away because Spain is a nice place to be, but they are no less 
British, I doubt many of them have taken up dual citizenship, but don't 
know the stats on that one.

Why we just hand out citizenship to people who come to work here, I have 
not got a clue.

Maria wrote:
> William Black wrote:
>> Maria wrote:
>>> William Black wrote:
>>>> Maria wrote:
>>>>> William Black wrote:
>>>>>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property 
>>>>>> prices in Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats 
>>>>>> back to the UK to throw themselves on the charity of the 
>>>>>> government,  demanding housing, hospital treatment and payments 
>>>>>> that they are,  of course, fully entitled to.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but 
>>>>>> nobody seems to have noticed...
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> What does that matter? Do you think that British citizens should 
>>>>> have the natural right of abode here or not? If not, where else, or 
>>>>> nowhere at all?
>>>>
>>>> Of course they have the right to live here.
>>>>
>>>> But why should they have the right to medical treatment,  free housing 
>>>
>>> As long as everyone else does, then why not? It's called Rule of Law.
>>
>> But many immigrants who pay taxes are not allowed access to public 
>> housing and several other benefits...
> 
> For one year. They are presumed to be able to pay for their own, just 
> like anyone else in work, unless they have special needs. Some of
> tThose migrant workers with dependent children seem to have been housed.

For at least two years and sometimes for five.

>>>> and an index linked pension?
>>>
>>> Who has an index-linked pension?
>>
>> Everyone.
>>
>> That's the point about all this.
>>
>> People who collect a UK Old Age Pension overseas soon discover it 
>> doesn't go up every year...
>>
>>
> 
> I thought the pension was not linked to the RPI?

IT isn't,  but it does go up most years.

However if you draw it abroad you don't get the increases...



-- 
William Black

"Any number under six"

The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of 
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat 
single handed with a quarterstaff.

Maria wrote:
> William Black wrote:
>> Sam wrote:
>>> On Nov 3, 12:35 pm, William Black  wrote:
>>>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in
>>>> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK
>>>> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding
>>>> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course,
>>>> fully entitled to.
>>>>
>>>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody
>>>> seems to have noticed...
>>>>
>>>> -- 
>>>> William Black
>>>>
>>>> "Any number under six"
>>>>
>>>> The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of
>>>> Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat
>>>> single handed with a quarterstaff.
>>>
>>> What has that got to do with it?
>>>
>>> It’s their homeland.
>>>
>>> I thought you were all for freedom of choice?
>>
>> I am.
>>
>> I'm also for people collecting from our benefits system only if 
>> they've paid into it.
>>
>>
> 
> So all those British people who have never paid in or not paid in very 
> much will not be entitled to anything at all - they'll have to beg, 
> steal or starve and live in a bush?

It's what we do to other refugees...

-- 
William Black

"Any number under six"

The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of 
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat 
single handed with a quarterstaff.

Sam wrote:

> Well, my father lives in Spain. 

Gottcha

-- 
William Black

"Any number under six"

The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of 
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat 
single handed with a quarterstaff.

Maria wrote:
> William Black wrote:
>> Maria wrote:
>>> Mel Rowing wrote:
>>>> On Nov 3, 4:04 pm, Maria  wrote:
>>>>> William Black wrote:
>>>>>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property 
>>>>>> prices in
>>>>>> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to 
>>>>>> the UK
>>>>>> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding
>>>>>> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course,
>>>>>> fully entitled to.
>>>>>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody
>>>>>> seems to have noticed...
>>>>> What does that matter? Do you think that British citizens should have
>>>>> the natural right of abode here or not? If not, where else, or nowhere
>>>>> at all?
>>>>
>>>> There is not even a question of a British citizen having right of
>>>> abode in the UK. It's simply a matter of law.
>>>
>>> And morally?
>>>
>>>>
>>>> However, it should never be forgotten that one man's rights or
>>>> entitlements are another's liabilities.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Sorry?
>>
>> He means 'Why should they be allowed free access to our benefits 
>> system and social services and health system 
> 
> Because everyone else who is a British citizen is entitled to do so. ?
> 
>> as they haven't paid a penny into it and have been sucking at the teat 
>> of the pension system to pay for their lavish lifestyle overseas for 
>> years?'
> 
> How are they entitled to a pension if they didn't pay in? How is 
> claiming one's pension 'sucking at the teat'?
> Mel is very keen on the notion of entitlement, especially wrt pensions.

But I'm not Mel,  I'm a very nasty piece of work...

He's the nice one...

I'm the one who thinks that if they've been sucking money out they 
should put it back.

>> They're not coming back because they want to,  they're coming back 
>> because they're broke.
> 
> So what? Nobody claims because they 'want to' (apart from scroungers who 
> have no intention of working) - people claim because they 'need' to.
> Perhaps since Britain pays £20 million to support the absent children of 
> Polish workers, it's time to introduce an EU-wide benefits system, 
> especially since it looks like full integration is on the cards.

Now let's try again shall we...

-- 
William Black

"Any number under six"

The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of 
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat 
single handed with a quarterstaff.

Maria wrote:
> William Black wrote:
>> Mick wrote:
>>> "William Black"  wrote in message 
>>> news:hcp81v$c7r$1@news.eternal-september.org...
>>>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices 
>>>> in Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to 
>>>> the UK to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  
>>>> demanding housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  
>>>> of course, fully entitled to.
>>>>
>>>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but 
>>>> nobody seems to have noticed...
>>>>
>>>> -- 
>>>> William Black
>>>>
>>>
>>> White, english born and bred and paid taxes for most of their working 
>>> life. No problem..
>>
>> They've spent twenty years sucking money out of the UK and contributed 
>> not one penny.
>>
> 
> So have thousands of people chucked out of work during the Thatcher era. 
> What do you want to do with them?

They didn't run to Spain,  then run back when they went broke...


-- 
William Black

"Any number under six"

The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of 
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat 
single handed with a quarterstaff.

FrereTuck wrote:
> On Tue, 03 Nov 2009 12:35:08 +0000, William Black wrote:
> 
>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in
>> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK
>> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding
>> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course,
>> fully entitled to.
>>
>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody
>> seems to have noticed...
> 
> hundreds of thousands?
> 
> lived there 20 years or so?
> 
> your source?

BBC R4 Today Programme,  this morning.

About a million of 'em

-- 
William Black

"Any number under six"

The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of 
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat 
single handed with a quarterstaff.

Maria wrote:
> FrereTuck wrote:
>> On Tue, 03 Nov 2009 12:35:08 +0000, William Black wrote:
>>
>>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in
>>> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK
>>> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding
>>> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course,
>>> fully entitled to.
>>>
>>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody
>>> seems to have noticed...
>>
>> hundreds of thousands?
>>
>> lived there 20 years or so?
>>
>> your source?
> 
> Looks like a wind-up to me anyway - there is nothing in the news about 
> it, and the expected flood that was reported at the beginning of the 
> credit crunch does not seem to have materialised.

On the radio this morning

also

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/jul/24/spain-expats?showAllComments=true

> He also hasn't said that they ought not to be entitled to vote, since 
> they have no interest in how Britain is run.

All British citizens have the right to vote in our elections.

Interestingly EC citizens resident in the UK don't for five years.

Although Commonwealth citizens do...


-- 
William Black

"Any number under six"

The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of 
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat 
single handed with a quarterstaff.

On Nov 3, 6:37 pm, William Black  wrote:
> Sam wrote:
> > Well, my father lives in Spain.
>
> Gottcha
>
> --
> William Black
>
> "Any number under six"
>
> The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of
> Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat
> single handed with a quarterstaff.

I very much doubt that.

Maria wrote:
> William Black wrote:
>> Maria wrote:
>>> Mel Rowing wrote:
>>>> On Nov 3, 4:04 pm, Maria  wrote:
>>>>> William Black wrote:
>>>>>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property
>>>>>> prices in Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British
>>>>>> expats back to the UK to throw themselves on the charity of the
>>>>>> government,  demanding housing, hospital treatment and payments
>>>>>> that they are,  of course, fully entitled to.
>>>>>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but
>>>>>> nobody seems to have noticed...
>>>>> What does that matter? Do you think that British citizens should
>>>>> have the natural right of abode here or not? If not, where else,
>>>>> or nowhere at all?
>>>>
>>>> There is not even a question of a British citizen having right of
>>>> abode in the UK. It's simply a matter of law.
>>>
>>> And morally?

Bugger morally!

>>>
>>>>
>>>> However, it should never be forgotten that one man's rights or
>>>> entitlements are another's liabilities.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Sorry?

Same as saying one mans rights are as one mans rights do!!

>>
>> He means 'Why should they be allowed free access to our benefits
>> system and social services and health system
>
> Because everyone else who is a British citizen is entitled to do so. ?

I believe so. If you have worked all your life in the UK, paid all your 
taxes and Nat. Insurance, then why should you not be entitled to the full 
caboodle, pension, NHS and all? Doesn't matter were you retire to.

>
>> as they haven't paid a penny into
>> it and have been sucking at the teat of the pension system to pay for
>> their lavish lifestyle overseas for years?'
>
> How are they entitled to a pension if they didn't pay in?

In that case they have NO entitlement, of course.

>How is
> claiming one's pension 'sucking at the teat'?

It is only an expression. But if you have paid into the State Pension then 
you are entitled to it. Sucking teats or not!

> Mel is very keen on the notion of entitlement, especially wrt
> pensions.

Well, I would be too!

>
>>
>> They're not coming back because they want to,  they're coming back
>> because they're broke.
>
> So what? Nobody claims because they 'want to' (apart from scroungers
> who have no intention of working) - people claim because they 'need'
> to. Perhaps since Britain pays £20 million to support the absent
> children of Polish workers, it's time to introduce an EU-wide
> benefits system, especially since it looks like full integration is
> on the cards.

It is, actually, an EU law which says we do have to pay to support Polish 
children of absent Polish workers. Rather like the EU fishing policy were 
the fisherman has to throw back the already dead fish that he has caught 
when he goes over quota! Madness!

-- 
Harry Merrick.

On Tue, 03 Nov 2009 13:07:28 +0000, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
 wrote:

>Mel Rowing wrote:
>> On Nov 3, 12:35 pm, William Black  wrote:
>>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in
>>> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK
>>> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding
>>> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course,
>>> fully entitled to.
>>>
>>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody
>>> seems to have noticed...
>> 
>> Ah! Yes! I mean to say! Err!
>> 
>> These are indigenous people well steeped in and appreciative of
>> British Culture. Direct descendants of Alfred the Great no doubt.
>
>So, you expect to see them in their posses hanging round the shops wit 
>der homies dealing drugs and mugging the OAPs? Or am I thinking of some 
>other "immigrants"?

perhaps all those gang bosses taking refuge in the
    s. of spain will come back and *reorganise* the
    'health' 'service'

regards

-- 
web site at www.abelard.org - news comment service, logic, economics 
 energy, education, politics, etc over 1 million document calls in year past
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  all that is necessary for       []     walk quietly and carry
  the triumph of evil is that     []           a big stick.
  good people do nothing     []    trust actions not words
                    only when it's funny -- roger rabbit
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

On Tue, 03 Nov 2009 12:35:08 +0000, William Black
 wrote:

>It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in 
>Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK 
>to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding 
>housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course, 
>fully entitled to.
>
>Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody 
>seems to have noticed...
>
Lets see, Spain has lots cheap houses in the sun and a history of
Islamic conquest. Britain has a Muslim problem. The solution is
obvious - a swap.

On Tue, 3 Nov 2009 04:58:35 -0800 (PST), Mel Rowing
 wrote:

>On Nov 3, 12:35=A0pm, William Black  wrote:
>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in
>> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK
>> to throw themselves on the charity of the government, =A0demanding
>> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are, =A0of course,
>> fully entitled to.
>>
>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so, =A0but nobody
>> seems to have noticed...
>
>Ah! Yes! I mean to say! Err!
>
>These are indigenous people well steeped in and appreciative of
>British Culture. Direct descendants of Alfred the Great no doubt.
>
People who can trace their ancestory to this country back several
hundreds of years have a lot more right to live here than people who
can trace it back one generation then back to Pakistan.

On Tue, 03 Nov 2009 13:29:08 +0000, William Black
 wrote:

>White Spirit wrote:
>> Dirk Bruere at NeoPax wrote:
>> 
>>> Mel Rowing wrote:
>> 
>>>> These are indigenous people well steeped in and appreciative of
>>>> British Culture. Direct descendants of Alfred the Great no doubt.
>> 
>>> So, you expect to see them in their posses hanging round the shops wit 
>>> der homies dealing drugs and mugging the OAPs? Or am I thinking of 
>>> some other "immigrants"?
>> 
>> We should indeed expect that.  We're all equal after all.  The crime 
>> statistics are obviously institutionally racist for reporting that 
>> Negroes commit 45% of all crimes in London and 79% of all violent 
>> crimes.  There is clear cultural bias at play and I applaud the BBC for 
>> doing their best to redress this shocking imbalance by withholding 
>> information relating to the ethnicity of black criminals and only 
>> broadcasting the ethnic background of white criminals.  That's what I 
>> call equality.
>> 
>
>I imagine the old lags coming back from the 'Costa del Crime' will 
>integrate pretty quickly.

The level of violence from Somaili gangs makes the Krays and the
Richardsons look like the Womens Institute

On Tue, 03 Nov 2009 16:49:22 +0000, William Black
 wrote:

>Maria wrote:
>> Mel Rowing wrote:
>>> On Nov 3, 4:04 pm, Maria  wrote:
>>>> William Black wrote:
>>>>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in
>>>>> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK
>>>>> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding
>>>>> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course,
>>>>> fully entitled to.
>>>>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody
>>>>> seems to have noticed...
>>>> What does that matter? Do you think that British citizens should have
>>>> the natural right of abode here or not? If not, where else, or nowhere
>>>> at all?
>>>
>>> There is not even a question of a British citizen having right of
>>> abode in the UK. It's simply a matter of law.
>> 
>> And morally?
>> 
>>>
>>> However, it should never be forgotten that one man's rights or
>>> entitlements are another's liabilities.
>>>
>> 
>> Sorry?
>
>He means 'Why should they be allowed free access to our benefits system 
>and social services and health system as they haven't paid a penny into 
>it and have been sucking at the teat of the pension system to pay for 
>their lavish lifestyle overseas for years?'
>
>They're not coming back because they want to,  they're coming back 
>because they're broke.
>
I  suppose the money to move to Spain magically appeared without them
having to earn it in this country ?

Most of them could afford to move abroad through hard work and having
successful businesses. Thus paying taxes,creating jobs, and not
claiming a penny in benefits. Of course you could claim they are all
criminals, which is as fatuous as claiming all working class Whites
are bone idle.

The fact the vast majority of immigrants into this country do so
because they aren't rich,skilled or successful. The vast majority of
people who leave do so because they are.

On Tue, 03 Nov 2009 16:46:55 +0000, William Black
 wrote:

>Sam wrote:
>> On Nov 3, 12:35 pm, William Black  wrote:
>>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in
>>> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK
>>> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding
>>> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course,
>>> fully entitled to.
>>>
>>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody
>>> seems to have noticed...
>>>
>>> --
>>> William Black
>>>
>>> "Any number under six"
>>>
>>> The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of
>>> Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat
>>> single handed with a quarterstaff.
>> 
>> What has that got to do with it?
>> 
>> It’s their homeland.
>> 
>> I thought you were all for freedom of choice?
>
>I am.
>
>I'm also for people collecting from our benefits system only if they've 
>paid into it.
>
Benefits are funded from general taxation. Everyone has paid into it.

On 3 Nov, 05:10, Mel Rowing  wrote:
> On Nov 3, 1:05�pm, "Mick"  wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > "William Black"  wrote in message
>
> >news:hcp81v$c7r$1@news.eternal-september.org...
>
> > > It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in
> > > Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK to
> > > throw themselves on the charity of the government, �demanding housing,
> > > hospital treatment and payments that they are, �of course, fully entitled
> > > to.
>
> > > Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so, �but nobody
> > > seems to have noticed...
>
> > > --
> > > William Black
>
> > White, english born and bred and paid taxes for most of their working life.
> > No problem..
>
> Certainly not for the past 20 years and in living abroad they have
> exported the income generated within their �pension schemes.
>
> > Black, coloured, Brown, muslim, haven't paid money into the system,
> > demanding housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are of course
> > not entitled to. �Big Problem.
>
> Predominantly young and as liable to tax as anyone else which they
> will continue to pay for many years no doubt subsidising some of the
> above.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Paying negligible amounts of tax and taking out more.

Mel Rowing wrote:
> On Nov 3, 1:07 pm, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax 
> wrote:
>> Mel Rowing wrote:
>>> On Nov 3, 12:35 pm, William Black 
>>> wrote:
>>>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property
>>>> prices in Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats
>>>> back to the UK to throw themselves on the charity of the
>>>> government, demanding housing, hospital treatment and payments
>>>> that they are, of course, fully entitled to.
>>
>>>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so, but
>>>> nobody seems to have noticed...
>>
>>> Ah! Yes! I mean to say! Err!
>>
>>> These are indigenous people well steeped in and appreciative of
>>> British Culture. Direct descendants of Alfred the Great no doubt.
>>
>> So, you expect to see them in their posses hanging round the shops
>> wit der homies dealing drugs and mugging the OAPs? Or am I thinking
>> of some other "immigrants"?
>
> Where that happens I think you'll find that one or two of our
> "indigenous" population have become involved also. Roguery is roguery
> and no society is free of it.

All societies have their toerags, some societies have such behaviour as core 
cultural values though.

William Black wrote:
> White Spirit wrote:
>> Dirk Bruere at NeoPax wrote:
>>
>>> Mel Rowing wrote:
>>
>>>> These are indigenous people well steeped in and appreciative of
>>>> British Culture. Direct descendants of Alfred the Great no doubt.
>>
>>> So, you expect to see them in their posses hanging round the shops
>>> wit der homies dealing drugs and mugging the OAPs? Or am I thinking
>>> of some other "immigrants"?
>>
>> We should indeed expect that.  We're all equal after all.  The crime
>> statistics are obviously institutionally racist for reporting that
>> Negroes commit 45% of all crimes in London and 79% of all violent
>> crimes.  There is clear cultural bias at play and I applaud the BBC
>> for doing their best to redress this shocking imbalance by
>> withholding information relating to the ethnicity of black criminals
>> and only broadcasting the ethnic background of white criminals. That's 
>> what I call equality.
>>
>
> I imagine the old lags coming back from the 'Costa del Crime' will
> integrate pretty quickly.

The costa del crime has not existed for two decades.

Shaun wrote:

> The fact the vast majority of immigrants into this country do so
> because they aren't rich,skilled or successful. The vast majority of
> people who leave do so because they are.

And when it all turns to shit they come back and ask the government for 
charity...

-- 
William Black

"Any number under six"

The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of 
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat 
single handed with a quarterstaff.

William Black wrote:
> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in 
> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK 
> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding 
> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course, 
> fully entitled to.
> 
> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody 
> seems to have noticed...
> 

Better perhaps than permitting the entry of a similar number who have 
never lived in Britain!

R

On Tue, 03 Nov 2009 22:32:39 +0000, William Black
 wrote:

>Roger Dewhurst wrote:
>> William Black wrote:
>>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in 
>>> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK 
>>> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding 
>>> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course, 
>>> fully entitled to.
>>>
>>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody 
>>> seems to have noticed...
>>>
>> 
>> Better perhaps than permitting the entry of a similar number who have 
>> never lived in Britain!
>> 
>>
>Why?
>
>
Because its a system practiced  by every other state in the World ?

Shaun wrote:
> On Tue, 03 Nov 2009 22:32:39 +0000, William Black
>  wrote:
> 
>> Roger Dewhurst wrote:
>>> William Black wrote:
>>>> It seems that the falling pound and the collapse of property prices in 
>>>> Spain may bring hundreds of thousands of British expats back to the UK 
>>>> to throw themselves on the charity of the government,  demanding 
>>>> housing, hospital treatment and payments that they are,  of course, 
>>>> fully entitled to.
>>>>
>>>> Of course they haven't lived here for twenty years or so,  but nobody 
>>>> seems to have noticed...
>>>>
>>> Better perhaps than permitting the entry of a similar number who have 
>>> never lived in Britain!
>>>
>>>
>> Why?
>>
>>
> Because its a system practiced  by every other state in the World ?

So?


-- 
William Black

"Any number under six"

The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of 
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat 
single handed with a quarterstaff.

Alang wrote:
> On Tue, 03 Nov 2009 18:36:17 +0000, William Black
>  wrote:
>
>
>
>>>
>>> I thought the pension was not linked to the RPI?
>>
>> IT isn't,  but it does go up most years.
>>
>> However if you draw it abroad you don't get the increases...
>
> It does in the EU

Are you sure? (A link would be helpful). It certainly used to be as 
William stated but that may have changed since of course.

Maria wrote:

> He also hasn't said that they ought not to be entitled to vote, since
> they have no interest in how Britain is run.

I believe that to retain the right to vote one has to have been on the
electoral register at least ten (perhaps 20) years before, which implies
at least a de facto residence in the UK.[0]

I cannot vote in the UK, and I consider that quite right having lived in
France for a very long time, but that does not mean I have no interest
in how Britain is run.

[0] I've just looked it up and this is the situation it seems:

"THE CURRENT SITUATION
British expatriates can vote in General Elections providing they have
not been away for more than 15 years. This has not always been the
case - indeed our electoral law has been evolving over the last few
decades. The Representation of the People Act 1985 first gave
expatriates the right to vote in General Elections, and then only for
the first 5 years of their absence. The right was exercised by the
elector choosing a proxy in the constituency in which they lived. The
Representation of the People Act 1989 extended the period of absence to
20 years in 1990.

Ten years later the Home Affairs committee discussed the issue (see
below) and recommended that the period should be reduced to 5 years.
This was rejected by the Government and Parliament, and instead the 2000
Act reduced the period to 15 years, which was applied from 2002. The
2000 Act also introduced the right to postal voting for expatriates."

From: http://euro-citizens.com/documents/Votes_for_expatriates.doc

Lou Ravi wrote:
> Alang wrote:
>> On Tue, 03 Nov 2009 18:36:17 +0000, William Black
>>  wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>>> I thought the pension was not linked to the RPI?
>>> IT isn't,  but it does go up most years.
>>>
>>> However if you draw it abroad you don't get the increases...
>> It does in the EU
> 
> Are you sure? (A link would be helpful). It certainly used to be as 
> William stated but that may have changed since of course. 

I understand it varies and every case is treated individually.

Each pensioner has to write and ask.


-- 
William Black

"Any number under six"

The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of 
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat 
single handed with a quarterstaff.

On Wed, 4 Nov 2009 11:17:46 +0100, "Lou Ravi"
 wrote:

>Alang wrote:
>> On Tue, 03 Nov 2009 18:36:17 +0000, William Black
>>  wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>>>
>>>> I thought the pension was not linked to the RPI?
>>>
>>> IT isn't,  but it does go up most years.
>>>
>>> However if you draw it abroad you don't get the increases...
>>
>> It does in the EU
>
>Are you sure? (A link would be helpful). It certainly used to be as 
>William stated but that may have changed since of course. 
>
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/BritonsLivingAbroad/Moneyabroad/DG_4000013

On Wed, 04 Nov 2009 12:30:42 +0000, William Black
 wrote:

>Lou Ravi wrote:
>> Alang wrote:
>>> On Tue, 03 Nov 2009 18:36:17 +0000, William Black
>>>  wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>> I thought the pension was not linked to the RPI?
>>>> IT isn't,  but it does go up most years.
>>>>
>>>> However if you draw it abroad you don't get the increases...
>>> It does in the EU
>> 
>> Are you sure? (A link would be helpful). It certainly used to be as 
>> William stated but that may have changed since of course. 
>
>I understand it varies and every case is treated individually.

Not according to the DWP website. It depends on where you are retired
to. 
>
>Each pensioner has to write and ask.

If they don't have your address you indeed have to write and apply for
your pension.

Maria wrote:
> So all those British people who have never paid in or not paid in very 
> much will not be entitled to anything at all - they'll have to beg, 
> steal or starve and live in a bush?

	Only if hard-hearted William becomes dictator.  Until then, and for
the foreseeable future, there is Guarantee Credit and/or Savings Credit.
These would, of course, be superseded by CI in a sane world ....

-- 
Andy Walker
Nottingham

Alang wrote:
> On Wed, 4 Nov 2009 11:17:46 +0100, "Lou Ravi"
>  wrote:
>
>> Alang wrote:
>>> On Tue, 03 Nov 2009 18:36:17 +0000, William Black
>>>  wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I thought the pension was not linked to the RPI?
>>>>
>>>> IT isn't,  but it does go up most years.
>>>>
>>>> However if you draw it abroad you don't get the increases...
>>>
>>> It does in the EU
>>
>> Are you sure? (A link would be helpful). It certainly used to be as
>> William stated but that may have changed since of course.
>>
> http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/BritonsLivingAbroad/Moneyabroad/DG_4000013

OK, thanks.

Maria wrote:
> I thought the pension was not linked to the RPI?

	Even this wretched government would not dare to link pensions
to RPI at the moment!  IIRC, they rushed out a guarantee that pensions
would go up by at least 2.5%.  Meanwhile, see

  http://www.pensionsadvisoryservice.org.uk/pension_rights/pension_increases

[most of it is about statutory increases in private pensions, but there
is a bit near the bottom about the state pension].

-- 
Andy Walker
Nottingham